Quiet isn’t an Option
Posted By AmyD. on June 3, 2008
Some disasters are natural ala Mother Nature and others are Man-made. I don’t know which is worse, I just know that in one, eventually the government steps in to help out, otherwise they just look bad. In the other, the government looks for scape goats and tries to ignore the distress of their constituents.
The latter has been my experience.
You may notice that I tend to focus on my kids. They are probably the only things that keep me getting out of bed on a day to day basis. Chickens, mice, birds, cats, dogs… well, I love them too and delving into their mayhem helps me forget about what I face on a day to day basis. What can I say? I prefer the “Law of the Jungle” rather than the pathetic excuse for the Law of Men that we pretend to follow.
My posts lately have looked more like they have been “phoned in” than they look like posts written by someone who gives a damn. I can’t give you any better a reason other than the fact that I spend a great deal of my time defending my work to people who can’t put a basic sentence together to save their pathetic jobs or lives for that matter.
But, that’s me, always striving for some sort of justification or justice rather, in a world filled with injustice and stupidity. After all… somewhere in Texas a village is missing it’s idiot. Clearly, there are bigger problems in the world.
There are times that I would love to leap up on my soap box and give you all my opinions on things from the current state of the economy to what is really going on in the real estate market. I hesitate because too many people think they know what’s going on, ie. “all these people who bought houses they couldn’t afford…” or “dead beat borrowers” or “people too stupid to read their loan contracts” and all you have to do is throw a virtual rock and you can hit a political or other similar type blog. My blog has always been my escape from my business and yet, these days I don’t have much of an outlet to vent the sort of frustration I’m experiencing right now.
For example, you keep hearing about the Feds cutting rates. Did you realize that each time they make a rate cut it takes nearly a year to work its way down to the level where it even might affect your pocketbook?
Did you realize that all of these rate cuts going on and the ONLY people making money off of them are the banks themselves? Nope, because all you hear are the banks whining about foreclosures, etc. And, no matter what sort of smoke screen the White House puts out… the banks are probably aren’t going to work with you on that loan on a house that you owe 50% more on than what it is actually worth.
(and please, for the LOVE OF GOD, ignore Zillow, it’s a freaking JOKE, my friend!)
Yet banks’ egregious greed and misdeeds of the past few years have made credit dry up, and so they’re keeping what they can get to themselves. Reading through the recent earnings reports of Bank of America (BAC, news, msgs), National City (NCC, news, msgs) and Citigroup (C, news, msgs), it’s hard not to get the impression that the banks have decided it’s every man for himself — the heck with the women, children and small businesses. – Article Here
Banks are making money off of those foreclosures. Banks are making money off the rate cuts and they are NOT passing those cuts down to the consumer. Banks have also tightened everything up to the point of sheer stupidity and it is obvious that every decision made is made by someone who is in fear of losing their job (Washington Mutual laid off over 6,000) which results in every decision being made out of fear and thus we have a giant convoluted mess that can only best be described as “paralysis through analysis.”
In short, they aren’t lending a dime. It’s getting harder and harder to get a refinance or purchase to close. Regardless of the borrower’s credit score. And, do you know what this is called? Closing the barn door after the cow has already gotten out, gone for a smoothie, considered a lesbian relationship, and then decided to go back to the bull who done her wrong to begin with.
And, where have the cows gone? Take a good look at several CEOs who gained in ridiculous bonuses to the point of nearly if not actually crippling the economy.
Right now, the real estate market IS heating up. A few months ago there was “too much inventory” meaning, a buyer’s market. In some areas that may still be the case. But, here where we are? There are more PENDING sales than ACTIVE listings. Realtors are doing more showings in a single month than they have done in the last six months combined. One realtor had 60 showings on a complete DUMP in ONE MONTH.
We aren’t seeing these sales close. And, the banks want us to blame the broker, the less than perfect credit scores, and ultimately, the real estate appraiser – simply because, quite frankly, they don’t WANT to loan. They will go as far as to penalize an appraiser who did a “by the book” appraisal by blacklisting them (if you are blacklisted a bank can’t use you), because according to stats that are being based off last fall (when things were in a sharp decline) they’ve decided that “this area” or “that area” is a declining market. Unfortunately, they don’t understand what constitutes a “declining” market. It’s based on the area employment base, economy, and real estate sales, not just sales.
Where we live the largest portion of the employment base is shared between agriculture and oil. Oil is at an all time record high at over $200 per barrel. It’s safe to say that the employment base around here is pretty stable. Yet, we constantly have to defend why we didn’t check the “declining” market box because someone doesn’t understand that declining is not strictly based on market sales alone.
We have had appraisals reviewed by people who have no experience in appraising properties, can’t even type a complete sentence, and worse yet, aren’t even capable of navigating the standard form that ALL APPRAISERS no matter where they are in the country HAVE TO USE.
So we spend hours researching and writing a 4 page rebuttal, showing where at times the reviewer committed fraud in an attempt to discredit our reports, showing where the reviewer actually just couldn’t find the information in the report that they claimed was missing, and finally, showing that our report went by the legal guidelines that all appraisers are held to (or they lose their license) and have no option of deviating from regardless of what the bank would prefer to see.
All so that the bank can say, “yeah, well, we like the lower value.” And basically ignore your rebuttal, research, and textbook appraisal so some flunky behind a desk using Zillow (a completely bogus service that never provides correct property information and is a complete joke) can bash our report when they don’t have the ability to even obtain the licensing that we have to have to do what we do.
The other side to all of this is that we actually saw the decline coming before it was in the papers, on the news, and long before the word “recession” was ever used. And, it seems that we are also the first to see what looks like a bit of a rally, a beginning of the end of the decline, perhaps. Unfortunately, the rest of the world is in such a panic – that this sort of news doesn’t get out.
Here in the armpit of California foreclosure sales are not selling below market value. People are under the impression that you can walk into a foreclosure and have a crap ton of equity ready to go. Not so… foreclosures, in many instances, are selling for around the same price as the house sold next door by a realtor.
The fact remains, if you want to find a culprit right now who is responsible for holding the market down and causing more stress on mortgage holders and completely ignoring all pressure from Washington to rework loans where homes are worth $50,000 – $100,000 less than what people OWE on them, look no further than the banks and lenders.
Big money and big business taking advantage of the regular, hardworking American yet again. And, if you think this doesn’t apply to you because you didn’t get an adjustable rate mortgage or refi when the market was at a high – remember, foreclosures in your neighborhood directly affect your home’s value. Not to mention that a vacant home never does a neighborhood any good, in fact, it always works quite the opposite.
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Yikes … Ok, Uhm, I am thinking you need to take a deep breath and tell us exactly how you feel about all this stuff.
:flaming: :demon:
I am thinking Bankers credibility rating has probably got to be right up there with used car sales men and maybe get rich quick scheme maker uppers.
Glad your not under any stress at all – whew!
Happy Happy Joy Joy :cheer:
Beamer
Honey, I think you need a hard drink, a deep breath, and then you can tell us how you REALLY feel about stupid people :heartbeat:
While I don’t keep an eye on the market, I’ve noticed that homes down here still go rather quickly. Mainly due to military; I know couples that aren’t old enough to buy their own alcohol (or they just turned 21, 22 on the outside) and have a home.
Just as I know that, in a few months, they’ll be back on post housing or renting an apartment.
Like you said, the banks don’t give a damn.
People are blaming someone other than the banks? The banks are the ones who created these loans that are now getting defaulted, and they relaxed their standards because they got greedy.
I disagree, though, that banks aren’t lending right now. In fact, they’re trying to come up with brand new loan products and trying to get as many loans as possible because they’re worried about the bottom line now. This is the best time to negotiate with a bank about a refi, because there are literally thousands of banks out there who want your good business so that they can offset some of the bad business they did.
I’m having trouble getting past the first paragraph to make an intelligent comment.
Can I just say, I love it when you write things like this? I think you should do it more often (if for no other reason than it is nice to read someone who knows their stuff and can explain it in regular-people speak)
Beamer –
Marissa – We did appraisals for several different condos in a town that has a huge military base. Basically, that town is supported by the military. The banks tried to say it was a declining market basically because it’s in California. That’s what I mean about them not understanding what exactly entails a “declining” market.
Avi – Really? How many underwriters have you talked to? You are in the middle of purchases and refinances that go through?
No, they really aren’t coming up with new loan products. And, they are NOT loaning unless your credit score is ridiculously high… meaning top of the line.
But, hey, what would I know about it, right? We’re just doing a necessary part of every loan transaction and then being used as a scapegoat later. We just watched a national news report where they are now trying to BLAME the appraisers for this real estate bubble popping.
Miss B – Why would that be? You don’t think what is going on in the economy and real estate is a disaster?
Erin – :thanks:
No, obviously what is going on in the real estate market and the economy is a disaster. And it’s affecting millions. I realize that. Obviously.
But having just spent a week literally walking through the remnants of a “natural” disaster, it’s really hard for me to compare the two without getting emotional.
I realize that is coming from my own personal experience, as this is from yours.
I will say though that as far as the government stepping in for natural disasters, it’s not nearly as sunshine and roses as we’d like to think. Or as helpful. All anyone I know has to show for FEMA’s efforts is a registration number that doesn’t amount to shit.
But hey, at least everyone I know personally is alive. So there’s that.
Britt – the fact is, eventually, the government shows up with trailers and things. Eventually they show up. Hurricane Katrina… yeah, they were late, they screwed up really bad there. And the place is still a mess… but at least people are there and trying to help.
Your house gets foreclosed on and NO ONE shows up. Not now… not ever.
I wonder how it might feel to be on the other end of the disaster spectrum where you lose your house while reading about how the government is putting pressure on banks to renegotiate (NOT REFINANCE) your adjustable rate mortgage loan and finding that the banks don’t give a shit about WHAT the government has to say and you and your kids pack up your shit and LOSE your home anyway?
There IS NO government relief there. Not immediate and not eventually. NONE. Worse yet, it makes it nearly impossible to rent a home or an apartment because now your credit score is in the toilet.
Yes, they are creating tons of new loan products and trying to get new lenders and trying to buy old loans at better rates. My wife literally works with and advises over 2,000 banks, most small and community banks, so she has an in-depth view of the loan offerings of every single one of them.
We have so many offers from banks who want to buy our mortgage and give us a reduced, fixed rate just so they can get our business, it’s unbelievable.
Avi – That’s great that you guys have loan offers. But, what I am specifically addressing here are the people who have watched their FICO scores DUMP because they left other bills unpaid in order to pay for their house payment and NOW the banks won’t work with them AT ALL.
They can create all the loan programs they want. It does NOT MEAN that the underwriters are going to allow them to go through and close.
“We have so many offers from banks who want to buy our mortgage and give us a reduced, fixed rate just so they can get our business, it’s unbelievable.”
Gee, that’s nice. Probably because you didn’t refinance or purchase during the boom. Just because YOU have personally been untouched by the real estate fall out – does not mean that that is the reality for everyone else.
I have seen many affected by this crap. Two of my best friends saw thier mortgages quadruple in less than a year. WTF? They have both lost their homes and now have resorted to renting. They cannot even live in apartments because of this fiasco. It’s a scary time and I have a gut feeling it is only going to get worse. Chris and I have tried to buy a house and our credit is not bad at all but it is not prestine. Hmmm can banks file bankruptcy? If so… we’re all screwed!
Amy, What do you think started this whole mess to begin with, other than outrageous greed by the Bankers? It seems like the Realtors were more than happy to see the real estate prices zoom skyward, at least that is the sense I got.
Beamer
Mindy – Exactly! And, you are right, without pristine credit – they won’t give you the time of day… and if you are in trouble? They won’t work with you then either. In fact, Countrywide is in some deep shit for basically forcing people into foreclosure.
Beamer – Here’s the thing. Credit was easy to get (and cheap to loan out) and many CEOs were given incentives for short term results that were incredibly risky in the long run and are partially responsible for this mess.
Everyone jumped on board then because there was too much easy money to be made. There were Realtors flipping houses, loan brokers flipping houses, I mean – look at Crisp and Cole!
Banks Greedy? I love the fact that B of A is more than happy tom allow Illegal aliens the ability to open up a savings and checking account and I believe a credit card. Do you run into Illegals in your daily routine or are you allowed to find out their residential status in the Good old USA?
Beamer
I’ve never really run into a situation like that. From our perspective, we just have to cross our t’s and dot our i’s in the sense that, names on contracts need to match names on public records, etc.
But, there have been lots and lots of property transfers between families.
Now I just got to get the image of you running around like Yosemite Sam with the ends of his mustache smoking like crazy yelling My biscuits are in Fire! My Biscuits are on Fire!
I crack myself up.
Beamer
Get rid of the Image
:rotflmao: Can’t… I like Yosemite Sam and Foghorn Leghorn.
I have pretty much zero knowledge in this area. I had no idea you were so smart! Who knew?! :yep:
Thank you for enlightening me though. You made me a bit smarter today (which isn’t hard to do, y’know!)
This is not directed at anyone specifically.
This post was not about comparing natural disasters to man-made disasters. I think that’s pretty clear here.
But, let’s take a moment to look at something, when natural disasters happen, families tend to come together and bond. People reach out and support one another, communities come together. And, it’s a blessing that comes out of something tragic.
On the flipside – foreclosures, drive families apart, cause divorces, and there is a stigma attached no matter why it happened, society looks at you as a “deadbeat” someone who does not honor their debts or as someone who was clearly so greedy to “have it all” that they were too stupid to read their contract or pay attention to the type of financing they were getting. There are rarely, if any blessings that come from that. Worse yet, communities do not come together to help, in fact, people start to back away from you rapidly.
I couldn’t agree more with your last statement. The family that I worked for until last week was regarded as “good people” until they got into financial problems. Since they had to sell the store people are coming out of the wood work to tear them apart or to get the dirty gossip about it all.
I feel like I can add a unique perspective here. I have experienced both. I have lost a house to an “act of God” and to foreclosure.
I can say that as far as the aftermath goes, loosing a house to fire was actually easier than foreclosure. And neither one are easy. Let me say, I was fortunate to not have lost the entire house, only about half. Because my photos were kept in Rubbermaid bins – I still have those precious memories. But with a fire, the help came out of the woodwork at us.
When we lost our house, we became one of “those people”, as if we were deadbeats who are a drain on society. We got all sorts us unsolicited “help” (and by help – I do mean JUDGEMENT) from well meaning friends. “What if you do this, have you tried that, surely there must be something you can do.” Plenty of people were willing to judge us for not being able to financially carry a mortgage that went up $600 in 5 months time. I would like to add – we were assured by our lender when we were signing papers that something like exactly happened to us, would never happen. Our mortgage “may go up a little, but it was just as likely to go down.”
They didn’t see me at the grocery store trying to feed a family of 5 for two weeks on less than $100. They didn’t see my husband and I stay up half the night trying to figure our how we are going to manage to cover bill, or even be able to pay the lousy $5 a month for our son to attend Boy Scouts. They didn’t hear the fights over money, or see the times that we didn’t eat dinner, just so we could be sure the kids did.
When you loose a house to a fire everyone has sympathy for you. It is still very hard to deal with the aftermath, but you don’t carry the social stigma that you do when you loose a house to foreclosure.
I do want this to diminish anyone else’s pain that they are going thru. Because I have learned that you can’t compare your pain to anyone else’s pain. A disaster is a disaster, no matter what or how it was caused.
Jen – I’m a fountain of surprises, aren’t I? :smooch:
J.O. – Amen. No one is gossiping about victims of Hurricane Katrina, are they? This world needs a big fat lesson on compassion for your fellow man (or woman
) :thanks:
Crazy Lady – :heartbeat: :heartbeat: I am so so sorry that you had to go through either of those things.
But I have to tell you how much I appreciate and respect your opinion here. You have so eloquently put into words what I could not and I hope that people reading this appreciate it as much as I do.
yes you are! Do you know where the fountain of youth is too? :thumbsup:
Shhhhhh. I’ll email you.
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